What is a Representative Prostitute?

The question of what is a representative prostitute is an important one.  I will answer it based on my own lived experience of prostitution and what I saw to be representative of the women I worked with, both indoors and outdoors and at the upper, middle and lower ends of prostitutions social spectrum.  I do so because there were certain commonalities between the lives and the attitudes of the women in all these areas of prostitution.  They were distinct and unmistakeable.

A representative prostitute is somebody who’s lived experience of prostitution and consequential attitudes towards it are those experienced by and held by the majority.  So of course in discerning what a representative prostitute is we need to look at what are the most commonly held attitudes among prostitutes, what are the most common opinions towards prostitution expressed by those who’ve lived it.  If we are to truly discern what the defining features of a representative prostitute is, then we need to know what are the most common reasons for their entry into prostitution and what are their feelings about those reasons, and about where those reasons led them.

We also need to know (and it is very important to know) what are the majority experiences and opinions of the formerly prostituted, because it has been charted that the opinions of women undertake a significant shift depending on whether they currently are or have ever been prostituted.  This has been noted, for example, in the Swedish Independent Evaluation of 2011.  Its findings make sense to me; in fact I don’t see how it could be any other way.  My own expressed opinions in prostitution were always constructed in the effort to protect myself.  I berated myself over that for quite a long while afterwards, but to the best of my ability, I don’t do that anymore, because it was only natural that I would protect myself anyway I could and I need to be understanding and gentle with myself about that.

A detailed analysis of the interior experiences of the prostituted class has yet, in my awareness, to be undertaken.  There have been many studies done that focus on prostitution, but not of the sort I am imagining: I would like to see a study that shaped the inner experience of prostitution for the publics understanding.  I wonder how possible that would be, given my memories of my own closed-off ‘this-far-and-no-further’ responses to questioning during prostitution.  I not only experienced that myself, but witnessed it constantly among at the attitudes of my peers to questioning by outsiders; so perhaps that is not even possible, or at least would not be possible in the absence of lie detector tests.  I know that’s what it would have taken to have gotten the truth out of me in those times.

So I think it is safe to assume we will be operating in the absence of such a study, and in its absence, cursory glances at other studies, even just here in Ireland, give us the strongest possible hints as to the reality of prostitution as a lived experience.  For example, the findings of the Haughey and Bacik analysis ‘A Study of Prostitution in Dublin’ (conducted with funding from the Department of Justice, Equality and Law Reform, Trinity College, June 2000) were very telling.  In this study, twenty-nine out of thirty prostituted women stated that they ‘would accept an alternative job with equal pay.’

Now this may not tell us the whole story, but it gives us an unmistakably clear signal that the vast majority of the women polled here, would not, if they could make the same money elsewhere, choose to experience another moment of prostitution ever again.

There are no surprises for me in what this study reveals.  In seven years of prostitution, I never met a woman who wouldn’t have accepted an alternative job with equal pay.  And yes, we did discuss these things, and many other aspects of prostitution besides.  We discussed them with each other, because we felt safe discussing them with each other; it was only under the scrutiny of strangers that our sense of safety evaporated, and our openness evaporated with it.

When we ask the question ‘What is a representative prostitute?’ we are asking (or ought to be asking) what is a representative prostitute globally.  When prostitution is the last resort for women in developed countries – when it is the last resort for women in countries with social welfare systems that are the envy of the rest of the world – then it is reasonable to assume that fiscal coercion is very much more the norm in countries that do not enjoy these supports.  Therefore, whatever we see of coercion in Europe or North America is nothing compared to what is experienced in numerous nations in Africa, Asia and South America.  We know that children in these nations are more liable to be prostituted than the children of western nations by many many times.  Are we to assume that the women and children of under-developed nations have a higher propensity to assert their ‘personal agency’ to prostitute themselves, as the pro-prostitution alliance would have us believe, or are we to assume that their extreme financial constraints – might – just – possibly – have something to do with that?

It is clearly unreasonable to assume that there is even a possibility that a globally representative prostitute could be characterised by the minority of western women earning two hundred pounds/euros/dollars an hour.  These women are not even representative prostitutes in the western world, never mind anywhere else.  Yet there are those who’ve never spent a moment being prostituted who like to play around with statistics so as to present the prostituted as a class who are, or at least may be, represented by the happy hooker mythology – those women who supposedly do nothing they don’t want to do, and what they do want to do, they do for up to, and in excess of, a thousand euros per night.  It is hard not to hate the non-prostituted hypocrites who peddle these myths, especially when they are women.  Where is their experienced-based evidence?  They have none.  Here is mine:

This is a short roll-call of some of the prostituted adolescents (it would not be accurate to call them women) that I have personally known and worked alongside.  I have changed their names out of respect for their privacy.

Lisa was a representative prostitute.  She left home at fifteen and was prostituted at seventeen.  She didn’t want to do it, but she couldn’t even consider going home, and there was nothing else she could do.

Anna was a representative prostitute.  She left home at fourteen because her stepfather had been sexually molesting her for years.  She was prostituted at seventeen, and found prostitution nothing very new.  The only difference was money changing hands, instead of sweets, clothes and gifts.  Most importantly for her, she could walk away at the end of the encounter, instead of having to sleep with her abuser all night in the same house.

Tori was a representative prostitute.  She left home at eighteen and was working as a stripper within six months – that was the gateway for her, and she was prostituted before she was twenty.  She was gang raped at twenty-one.  She was supposed to see them all one by one.  She would never have the right to say what was done to her, because they paid her before it happened.

Lillianne was a representative prostitute.  She left home at seventeen and was working the streets within the year.  I will remember her vulnerability and her first-night frightened face forever.  “Do you think he’ll be okay?” she asked before she got into the car.  I gave her arm a quick squeeze and offered the useless guidance “Keep your wits about you”.

Marie was a representative prostitute.  She left home at fifteen and was prostituted at seventeen.  Marie, who didn’t even know how to roll a joint when she first started in prostitution, was hopelessly addicted to narcotics for years while we worked together, and was still strung-out the last time I saw her.  I remember her childlike embarrassment at not being able to roll a joint, but she got good at that in no time.  There are so many other things I wish she’d never learned.

I was a representative prostitute.  I left home at fourteen and was prostituted at fifteen.  I am still here, I am still alive, and thankfully I am no longer narcotic addicted.  The voices I echo are not only my own; for my sake and for all our sakes, I will never ever be silenced.

So yes, the question of what is a representative prostitute is an important one; it is just unfortunate that it is sometimes posed by those who go on to answer it dishonestly, in the effort to obscure what a representative prostitute truly is.  A good hint as to the intentions of anyone posing this question is in how they will construct it.  Members of the pro-prostitution alliance will far more likely use the sanitising/normalising language of ‘sex work’; therefore will most likely ask ‘What is a representative sex-worker?’

This is an exercise in misrepresentation and concealment; obscurest language here is such a commonplace theme.  The profile of a representative prostitute needs obscuring for anyone of the pro-prostitution lobby, because the profile of a representative prostitute lays bare the immeasurably ugly profile of prostitution itself.

FreeIrishWoman

25 thoughts on “What is a Representative Prostitute?

  1. Pingback: What is a Representative Prostitute? « Survivors Connect Network

  2. Pingback: Trafficking, Prostitution, the Denial of Authenticity and the Ongoing Struggle to Impose Silence « Survivors Connect Network

  3. i just found this blog and have high hopes for it to continue. keep up the great work, its hard to find good ones. i have added to my favourites. thank you.

  4. Interesting and informative.

    I have a question for you.

    In my life, I met and attempted to date (and I mean really date, like dinner/movie sort of real relationship date) two prostitutes (not at the same time, on two separate occasions). Of course they propositioned me and I turned them down with this statement. “I would rather get to know you than buy you. How about dinner on me instead?”
    I was sincere.
    One agreed to meet me the next day, but halfway through the dinner she got up and walked out. I had been trying to hold a sincere and friendly conversation. Ever since then, if she saw me she just blew me off. I never judged her. I assumed she wasn’t interested in me and that was that.
    The other one, we went to lunch a week later. We talked about her plans for the future. She admitted that she didn’t like prostitution to me then and told me that she wanted to be an accountant. It just so happened that I had information for people looking for an accountant. It was a long time ago now, but I can’t remember if she had her degree or was almost finished getting it. Anyways, I tried to set up a few interviews for her. She never called me back and blew off the interviews.
    In following your blog, (and perhaps you now understand my sensitivity to your “Good Punter” article) I am still very puzzled by these two experiences. I stress again, I never slept, bought or otherwise treated either of these women like a prostitute. I treated them as I would any human being in a tragic situation. My question is then, if they wanted change so much, and they wanted “out” or any other work besides this…my question is Why would they reject an honest opportunity?
    I want to re-emphasize that I was sincere and I also doubt they could have thought I was otherwise.

    • Or maybe you had an attitude of condescension and pity that they couldn’t tolerate. Or maybe they thought you were one of those guys that wants it for free, because all you did was drool at their tits the whole time. Or maybe you wanted to get to know them better, but they didn’t want to get to know you any better. Your attitude seems to be that they should be somehow obligated to you because you bought them dinner and that WHORES should feel lucky when they’re taken out to dinner because it’s more than they deserve. Whores are not like normal women who are allowed to be uninterested, and so if they don’t return your calls it must be because they love their job and really love fucking strange men, not because they don’t ever want to see you again.

      • I will say I don’t particularly care for the tone of your response, but I am listening to it with sincerity.

        I suppose it is possible that I came off condescending. It certainly wasn’t my intent, but having had my own experiences, I know how one can become hyper-sensitive to another’s behavior. I am also aware of my character flaws, which makes me aware of why I have been rejected so many times in the past. So yes, this is a possibility. I doubt they thought I was a serial killer, but I don’t know much what could have been in their heads as I didn’t have much time to get to know them.

        As far as “want it for free” if you call forming a lasting partnership and marriage “wanting it for free” then perhaps yes. Actually, I don’t particularly like sex. Which precludes my “drooling over her tits” as you put it.

        You also seem to presume that I thought she should feel lucky. Right. She should feel lucky to go out with me? Or to be treated to dinner? These women make far more than I do, and that is a fact I’m not ignorant of. I don’t encourage that lifestyle, but dinner is something she can certainly afford on her own. More likely she rightfully felt she was “out of my league” as I had confidence issues. I’m much more secure now than I was then, but if anything she saw ME as a pathetic loser.

        And where do you get to say that I presumed she wasn’t like a normal woman? That somehow she didn’t have the right to NOT be interested. Of course she has that right. I found the behavior peculiar was all. In particular with the young woman I tried to help her make connections with real work that would get her OFF the street. She came off as disinterested. What am I supposed to think? Oh, well, I hate prostitution: I want to be an accountant, but to hell with anyone that could connect me with THAT job. But perhaps, this is where I came off as self-righteous and “I’m gonna save you” crap you were talking about. I could see how that would put someone off. Again, not my intent at the time as I wasn’t even seeing it as “rescuing” her. I wanted a friend and thought I was helping one out. But its not how I perceived my actions, its how she did that causes the reaction.

        This isn’t the place to discuss my inadequacies in dating. We’ve all had our failures before we eventually meet someone we really connect with.

        My question, perhaps poorly worded was really this: I was trying to present an opportunity to build a friendship. One that could help them out of the “hole” they were in. Why would someone in what is portrayed here as such a nightmare, walk away from such an opportunity to “get out”?

        But the question is answered actually in that people are very complex. There are trust issues involved and fears. Ironically, I should have already known this.

        At the time I posted this comment/question I never really considered prostitution as anything other than another job, like any other profession, that you work at or don’t. Like a bartender, waiter, stripper, doctor, cashier, etc… It never occurred to me that, as the posts themselves put it, that anyone that wasn’t directly pimped or trafficked could be doing it for any other reason than why I might work at McDonald’s. The question is in hindsight, not one that I went into the situation thinking. I went into it believing she did it because she liked it. It is only now that I question that thinking in the first place.

        I never looked down on a prostitute. I don’t use the term whore as I find it disrespectful and degrading to women. And as black people shouldn’t say “nigger” a woman shouldn’t use the term “whore” either. It degrades yourself and makes people think this is “ok” language to describe you or other women with and it isn’t.

        For the record, I accepted that they “weren’t interested” as I have found to be true with many other women in the past. I was reflecting on the experience in context of the blog.

        Thank you for your (apparently angry) reply however as you gave me a viewpoint to use for reflection on the experience.

      • My more full response is directly below, however, you made this comment:

        ” Or maybe they thought you were one of those guys that wants it for free…”

        and it bothered me for awhile and I had to take some time to think on it. I may be mistaken about your intent in saying that, but I want to point out that it is a very damning statement. The statement, you see, implies heavily that sex “Should” be paid for and not free. It implies that anyone attempting to “get it for free” is a pervert and a cheat. I find that to be a very very warped view on sex.

        I sincerely hope that it was a misunderstanding on my part or at worst a poorly worded response.

        Furthermore, in sarcasm you said :

        ” they love their job and really love fucking strange men”

        Again, sarcastically, meaning that the intent was the opposite of the actual statement.

        Thousands of women and men go to single bars, clubs, online dating services. There are swinger groups were singles and couples, married or not can get together to have sex with strangers, friends, etc… How hard is it then, with groups of people like this, with sex and procreation being the most powerful motivator of humankind, to make a leap of logic that someone would enjoy the opportunity to profit from the act. Be it a swingers club, a dating service or even yes, a prostitute.

        The physical act of sex is supposed to be pleasurable. My problem with your statement then, is that in face of all the groups of people, men and women, who admit to enjoy “fucking strangers” and actively try to, that you somehow think we should assume that not a single one of them would ever THINK to make money from it. I challenge that line of reasoning.

        That being said, I’m listening to what Rachel has to say on the matter with the greatest of sincerity. I’ve learned a lot from her experiences. I’m at a point where I am seeing a different side to all this. When your words seethe with anger, your message becomes lost and you lose credibility. If you want to effectuate change, stop being angry at the people you want to see the message. You can’t judge others. Not if you want to get anywhere anyways.

        Good luck to you Anna. I hope you find your peace.

        • Hi Ken,

          I apologize for the snarky tone. I can see by your comments that your questions were sincere.

          You said:
          “I suppose it is possible that I came off condescending.”

          Yes, that was my point. You said you approached the women as you would approach any other tragic human being. Red flag! How do you think pimps approach women? Predators always try to find a woman’s weaknesses so they can prey on them. I never approach ANYONE as a “tragic human being.” I approach them as a FELLOW human being.

          “I am also aware of my character flaws, which makes me aware of why I have been rejected so many times in the past.”

          Also my point. If ordinary women tend to reject you, then your astonishment that a prostitute would reject you too shows that you don’t place them in a class of women who have the right to reject you. And even though you didn’t say so in your original post, I already knew that you were being rejected by women in general. It takes a special kind of personality to get someone to get up and walk out of a restaurant in the middle of a meal.

          When I referred to you “wanting it for free” I was referring to getting intimate with a prostitute, which costs money. From the prostitute’s point of view, talking to men is business and not pleasure unless it’s a VERY special man. You do know that a lot of men pay just to speak to a prostitute, right? So in the prostitute’s mind, you were probably one of those annoying guys who doesn’t have the money to buy her services, but wants to use them anyway. You say you wanted to be “friends,” but then you say you wanted much more – a relationship, possibly even a wife. That’s a lot to want from a total stranger. Even friendship is not lightly given. Often that’s how women and girls are dragged into prostitution in the first place – by a “sincere offer of friendship.” So stalking prostitutes with the thought that they may be suckered into getting intimate with you when other woman have not wanted to is putting prostitutes in a special class of women that can be bought just through the offering of a connection or dinner.

          The important thing here is that you would never write about how you met a “woman” and offered her a job connection and then she didn’t take you up on it or see you again – that would just be a banal story of ordinary rejection. But somehow if it’s a prostitute, she has to do accept your offer or something is wrong with her – it means that she really likes her work, it means she is screwed up. Well she might be screwed up, but that still doesn’t mean she needs YOU to fix her life. The “connections” you say you offered isn’t much to offer. Anyone can apply for a job. And there are endless other reasons, such as the fact that most prostitutes, once in the life, don’t feel they are suited for any other kind of life, and that it takes soul-searching and a personal process to make the transition. It’s so simplistic of you to think that a total stranger needs “you” to make an important transition in their life.

          So your story reads like the story of someone who specifically goes to a prostitute, stalks prostitutes even, because they are attracted to the sorts of fantasies attached to prostitutes, but then wants to be treated specially and to not have to pay for what other men pay for; or perhaps feels they are “above’ paying, and moreover has such a sense of entitlement that they complain about this preposterous rejection on a blog.

          I never said that no one would ever think to charge money for sex. Where did you get that from? But you’re connecting prostitution with sexual pleasure, which shows you haven’t really understood anything Rachel has written here. In prostitution one person is getting sexual pleasure – the person paying for it. The other person is getting money. Any pleasure is incidental and highly unlikely given the coercive and abusive nature of the exchange. You are also painting a scenario in which a woman is attracted to a man and has sex with him, and then charges money. We are referring here to prostitutes who are servicing clients that they are not attracted to and that they don’t want to have sex with, which is essence is paid rape.

          • I never placed prostitutes in a separate class than other women. It was only when I put it in context of the blog that I separated them. I had no idea men paid prostitutes to just talk to them. Really.

            I understand time is money. I just never thought…and for that I feel bad perhaps, because I unwittingly misled her/them.

            Am I such a miserable human being that people would only spend time with me if I paid them? That is truly disheartening for me. I don’t know how to correct my own flaws so that …

            You are right. It takes a special kind of person for someone to get up halfway through a meal. However, that I have little remorse for since I really think it had more to do with our mutual inability to relate than anything else. I think you are right. I probably came off as one of those “wants it for free” types. I never knew they existed.

            The idea of no one ever charging money for sex I think is intrinsic to this blog. The essence of prostitution is the exchange of money for sex. It permeates every article written. And so, I perhaps assumed upon you, a certain degree of anger regarding the exchange–and even with Rachel in her many articles, especially including “Where was the “Happy Hooker”?” article that no one ever thinks to exchange money for sex.

            The difference here is talking about forced (by a non-choice and/or trafficking) prostitution and that of “desired” prostitution. Rachel seems to feel strongly that NO ONE desires to be a prostitute. That is what I have difficulty accepting.

            I will reiterate a previous comment I made though, for any “passive readers” on these comments: “Is it really worth your momentary orgasm that you might be hurting someone permanently?” I don’t think it is.

            That being said, it is also where I assumed in your comments that “no one would pay or accept money for sex willingly.” Nothing you said directly, just implied by virtue of the blog. Apologies if I’m again, off.

          • Ken,

            You think I implied that “no one would pay for or accept money for sex willingly.” Well obviously men who pay for sex do so willingly. And yes, women who are prostitutes accept money willingly. But this does not equate to women having sex with clients willingly. They endure the sex for the sake of the money. The fact that close to one hundred percent of prostitutes are either poor, mentally ill, or drug addicted should already tell you something about the nature of that “choice.”

          • By the way, the comment I made about “she must love fucking strange men” referred specifically to your assumption that because a prostitute did not want to take you up on your “connections” that this was somehow proof that she liked her job. Try approaching a prostitute with an offer of an actual job (not just a connection) that pays as well as prostitution, and see what happens then. Even then she would be in her rights to turn the job down, as you would be a random stranger approaching her and wanting to “get to know her.” This would imply that getting to know you better was part of the deal, and she would be free to walk away from that for obvious reasons which might have nothing to do with how she felt about her job.

  5. Hi Ken,

    I take back what I said about stalking prostitutes. I reread you original post, and it seems they propositioned you first. Sincere apologies for that.

    • Anna,

      I am something of a social misfit and have been for a large part of my life. I credit experiences I care not share here. I have studied psychology and been through numerous therapists in an attempt to connect with others. I am not a bad person and it has taken me years upon years to understand that. I am telling the truth, more so than you will believe, that I think twice before I slap a mosquito for biting me. I too have a monster within, and I horribly fear letting it out. In short, I just have difficulty connecting with people and it is a terrible burden to always be alone.

      I appreciate your candid and honest, non-judgmental answer here. You make some solid points. Points that may be obvious to others, and granted, I look at them and think “duh”. But honestly, I never considered it before you stated it.

      The only reason I mentioned the fact that they were prostitutes was in context of the blog. To me, it honestly didn’t seem to make a difference until I read the blog.

      You are correct in my “tragic human being” thinking. I will correct my thinking in the future. There are no “tragic humans” there are only fellow humans with tragic circumstances.

      My astonishment (and I think that may be a strong word) wasn’t so much that a prostitute wouldn’t jump at the chance, so much as it was that she couldn’t see me as sincere. I’ve explained how at the time I saw it as “just another job”. But as a psychologist sees many patients, a prostitute sees many men in many circumstances. Perhaps it was much to be seeking friendship or more considering. I’ll not feel guilty for extending myself. I refuse to. At the time I really had no comprehension of what her circumstances really were, and therefore, couldn’t relate to her. Likely, that is the cause.

      I’ve never looked down on another human being. Never once. My words may sound otherwise, but I tell you honestly, I have never wanted anything other than fairness and equality for everyone. No one should ever be forced into something they don’t want, whatever the reason. We live once and it should be an experience of one joy to the next. Unfortunately, for the vast majority it is not. It is only one pain to the next and “joy” is the lesser of horrors we experience. I remember walking into my therapist at 8 telling him how happy I was that I only had one beating that day. I now know, this is not living…its surviving.

      I know I am intelligent. I am perhaps frozen as a nerd type. I have an IQ hitting 146, which is just above genius according to the tests I’ve taken. But I am also arrogant, egotistical and self-centered. I’m especially condescending of others when they say or do things that are “stupid”. These are my life-long flaws and I have many others.

      Thank you for your patience. I am really trying to learn. I will reread Rachel’s articles and try harder to learn from them. I will, as I told her in a more private message, however, point out the “holes” in her argument, or at least play Devil’s Advocate.

      Take care Anna. Thank you.

      • Hi Ken,

        I do appreciate your attempts at sincerity and in trying to understand, but you are coming to this blog with a decidedly hostile attitude and you do not actually have the openness you seem to think you have. Your arrogance in pointing out “holes” in Rachel’s arguments is simply staggering to me. I have read every post on this blog and I am almost finished reading her book, and everything she says is true not only for prostitutes, but for women in general (to a much less brutal extent) under an oppressive patriarchal system in which men feel entitled to women’s bodies and have selfish desires that are either unexamined or intentionally designed to hurt. This is lived female experience. How can there be holes in someone’s lived truth? Her arguments are not even arguments as much as they are attempts to explain how it feels to be used in the way she was used.

        Your arrogance is all over your comments. What if I said I wanted to “poke holes” in your “argument” that you are a social misfit and have suffered for it? I could say something like, “well I have never had any problems relating to other people, so I simply don’t believe that there are people who really have this problem.” Or, “you may suffer from this problem, but I sincerely doubt that everyone does. Some people must really love being repellent to other people. I’m going to try to find one in order to poke holes in your truth of what you have lived.” Absurd.

        • And of course, the really vile thing behind your “attempts to pick holes” is that there is obviously an agenda behind it. Why is someone’s personal truth so threatening to you? Because you want to believe that there is a class of women out there who exist for your sexual satisfaction for payment.

          • Anna,
            Some of my earlier posts, many of which I believe Rachel removed (thankfully) are indeed rather closed minded about the topic. I originally took offense to the “good punter” article in that equating prostitution to rape, and the clients to “gentle rapists”. That’s an entirely different subject. For those earlier posts, I do apologize and say that I’ve read more of the blog since them.

            My later posts are not bent at attacking Rachel or her experiences, nor anyone else’s. I have no hostile intent, nor any reason to be hostile. I want to understand what is going on, and by “poking holes” in the argument I am trying to understand it. I’m actually hoping someone fills in those gaps. One commenter, “Feminist Rag”, is exceptionally good about this. I try to read all her comments and responses when I can.

            I am not afraid of the truth. I’m afraid of my own ignorance.

            This blog seeks to educate people to an experience. A horrible one. In order to understand that experience it will be challenged. If not by me, then others.

            I never said that Rachel or anyone else didn’t actually have the experience they claim.

            I understand this is her lived experience. I’m trying to understand how some of it happened. Take, for example, the Jim Wrong article. I posted a comment about this there, but it is basically like this:

            “Even if you were in a forced choice situation, why were you compelled to accept even clients like this?”

            I don’t understand that, I’m not saying it didn’t happen. I’m not saying it wasn’t horrific. I just don’t “get it”. The “Why?” of it.

            I don’t want to argue. I’m not here to debate. The point of prostitution being bad is made through the non-contested fact that people are indeed trafficked and put in a forced choice.

            Perhaps there is nothing to understand beyond that.

          • Anna,
            A side note: you said:
            “your “attempts to pick holes” is that there is obviously an agenda behind it.”

            My “agenda” if you want to call it that is to have a total understanding of the situation, so that, if confronted by someone I’m trying to tell the horrors of it to, I will have an answer. I don’t readily because I was not in that situation. The “holes” being the gaps in understanding or connecting the experience to the “why” of it.
            As I said a moment ago, perhaps there is no “understanding it” beyond that it is a horrible thing that is inflicted upon people.

            Out of respect, I will stop “poking holes” and asking questions. I never meant disrespect, but perhaps my questions shouldn’t be asked here.

          • Ken, with all due respect, usually when people say they want to poke holes in someone’s argument it means they are trying to refute it in some way. I was and am aghast that you wrote that, and I don’t think I misunderstood your meaning. Wanting to fill in the gaps is different language and it has a different meaning. Perhaps if you really want to learn more you should read Rachel’s book. She explains everything in depth there.

            I think I myself can answer your question about Jim Wrong. When a client is a regular and has paid you can’t turn him down without risking offending him and losing his business, and then you will get in bad with the management. I remember when I worked as a drink hostess in theory you could refuse to serve certain men, but in practice you would rarely ever do that if it was a paying client and never if it was a regular. The humanity of the girls working was never as important as the customer’s dollar. Clients would sexually abuse you and then laugh, and you would have to laugh too and go along with whatever they did or else you couldn’t really work there. Disgusting clients are all part of a woman’s “regular” job in prostitution. I hope that answers your question.

  6. My essential problem, I think, is that I don’t understand the basic way people communicate. I studied psychology, and yet I still don’t get it. Again, I attribute things from my past that have no business here. I’m sorry.

    I don’t want to hurt anyone. I don’t want to refute someone’s experiences. Those are theirs. I only want to understand them. I use words poorly, though you might not see it. I speak, but don’t always understand the impact of what I say. I think it is well summed up with a childhood spoken “I wanna kill him” when I meant to say “I’m mad!” and that is an honest truth. I often don’t know what I say to what it means.
    Even recently a professor told me “You realize how funny your exaggerations are, don’t you?” and I’d thought I’d aptly described an experience.

    I desperately want to read Rachel’s book, but I don’t know the title. I’m embarrassed to say that, but the truth is….what is the title?

    Honestly Anna, I hate myself. I drink myself silly every night. It has nothing to do with prostitutes or sex. Honestly, sex is far from my mind. I just struggle with how anyone else in this world could have had a worse experience. It appalls me. Is the human race really this debase and unenlightened? Is there hope? Why do we do this to each other?

    You don’t need to answer. There is a fact that they do, and THAT is what needs addressing. An end of mutual respect. Sadly, we are still far from that end.

    • perhaps I meant an “end GOAL of mutual respect” not an “end To mutual respect…” Sorry. I’m trying to be especially careful. That last post was…”real” and from the heart.

    • Ken,

      Not to beat a dead horse, but you did also say you wanted play devil’s advocate and that you wanted to challenge Rachel’s arguments. I simply wanted to point out to you that this is not an intellectual argument that you can poke holes in – it’s the truth of someone’s life. I think now you see what I mean, and I appreciate that.

      Rachel’s book is called “Paid For,” her name is Rachel Moran, and you can get it on Amazon.

      I truly am sorry that you are so unhappy, and I hope that you can find your own way to a more integrated life. I found Rachel’s book uniquely inspiring as an example of that. When you read it you will find that in the face of so much evil in the world, there are people who can shine a light into hidden areas, disperse the darkness, and turn abjection into truth and strength. And already laws are changing around the world to help women who have suffered under similar circumstances. So yes, there is hope.

      • Anna,
        I want to thank you for helping me to understand this blog and what this is all about.
        My problem was indeed that I had the wrong perspective, taking it as an intellectual debate. I do see now that that is/was the wrong approach and not the intent of the blog itself.
        I also want to thank you for taking the time to explain and answer my questions. You really have helped me to understand this problem. One I previously wasn’t truly aware of.
        I offer my sincere apologies to any and all I’ve offended on this blog. With stubborn asses like myself, it must be a horribly difficult “battle” to make your point and just share experiences. So for what its worth, my deepest and most sincere apologies.
        I’m going to do some more research on this and find out more about what I can do to help. Particularly getting equal educational opportunities for people I think is a great beginning.

  7. Jim Wrong…
    I think I get it.

    How … horribly disgusting he is…a summation of all of what is just….not right with this…

    and how inescapable he is.

    Does he not start out as “the nice guy”? The “good punter”? And then he turns….

    Jesus. So many subtypes and malfunctions….so very many maledictions….

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